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RE: jumping into the fray

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From: Kimberly Herbert (kimberly_at_TeacherArtExchange)
Date: Mon Nov 06 2000 - 13:48:43 PST


<snip>1. Whose bright idea was this anyway? How can we change it so that
our votes actually matter?<snip>

1. The founding fathers. They felt the election of the president was too
important to be directly elected (senators were appointed by state
legislatures in the beginning only Representatives were elected directly.
The Senate changed in 1913. (Amendment XVIII)). Each state gets electoral
votes equal to 2 senators + # of representatives in congress. Oh citizens of
DC get 3 votes also, but do not have voting representation in the congress
even though they pay federal taxes. The territories do not get a vote and do
not pay federal taxes. It would take a constitutional amendment to switch
to a direct election. Will not happen unless electoral collage vote is
different than majority of popular election (No Clinton did not receive less
popular votes than one opponent he received a plurality (less than 50% more
than any other one candidate)

<SNIP> 2. When did we elect the electoral college? I don't remember voting
for any of them. <SNIP>
2. You vote tomorrow for them. The candidate who wins the popular vote in
your state gets all your electoral collage votes.

<snip> How do you know which candidate your electoral college is being paid
to vote for?<snip>
3. They vote for the candidate who wins the popular election in your state,
but they are not legally bound to do so.

Those who have been on the list know I prefer primary documents for this
type of discussion so I'm cutting and pasting the pertinent parts of Article
2 Section 1 and Amendment XII that deals with the electoral collage below
for you to read. As you can see the founders expect more that 2 major
parties to participate in the election. The candidates must get 270
electoral votes to win. If candidate A wins the larges 11 states and
candidate B wins the other 39, candidate A wins the presidency. Those 11
states are California 54, New York 33, Texas 32, Florida 25, PENNSYLVANIA
23, ILLINOIS 22, OHIO 21, MICHIGAN 18, NEW JERSEY 15, NORTH CAROLINA 14,
VIRGINIA 13, (Total 270)
Article II
Section 1.
The executive power shall be vested in a President of the United States of
America. He shall hold his office during the term of four years, and,
together with the Vice President, chosen for the same term, be elected, as
follows:
Each state shall appoint, in such manner as the Legislature thereof may
direct, a number of electors, equal to the whole number of Senators and
Representatives to which the State may be entitled in the Congress: but no
Senator or Representative, or person holding an office of trust or profit
under the United States, shall be appointed an elector.
The electors shall meet in their respective states, and vote by ballot for
two persons, of whom one at least shall not be an inhabitant of the same
state with themselves. And they shall make a list of all the persons voted
for, and of the number of votes for each; which list they shall sign and
certify, and transmit sealed to the seat of the government of the United
States, directed to the President of the Senate. The President of the Senate
shall, in the presence of the Senate and House of Representatives, open all
the certificates, and the votes shall then be counted. The person having the
greatest number of votes shall be the President, if such number be a
majority of the whole number of electors appointed; and if there be more
than one who have such majority, and have an equal number of votes, then the
House of Representatives shall immediately choose by ballot one of them for
President; and if no person have a majority, then from the five highest on
the list the said House shall in like manner choose the President. But in
choosing the President, the votes shall be taken by States, the
representation from each state having one vote; A quorum for this purpose
shall consist of a member or members from two thirds of the states, and a
majority of all the states shall be necessary to a choice. In every case,
after the choice of the President, the person having the greatest number of
votes of the electors shall be the Vice President. But if there should
remain two or more who have equal votes, the Senate shall choose from them
by ballot the Vice President.
The Congress may determine the time of choosing the electors, and the day on
which they shall give their votes; which day shall be the same throughout
the United States.
<snip>
Amendment XII (1804)
The electors shall meet in their respective states and vote by ballot for
President and Vice-President, one of whom, at least, shall not be an
inhabitant of the same state with themselves; they shall name in their
ballots the person voted for as President, and in distinct ballots the
person voted for as Vice-President, and they shall make distinct lists of
all persons voted for as President, and of all persons voted for as
Vice-President, and of the number of votes for each, which lists they shall
sign and certify, and transmit sealed to the seat of the government of the
United States, directed to the President of the Senate;--The President of
the Senate shall, in the presence of the Senate and House of
Representatives, open all the certificates and the votes shall then be
counted;--the person having the greatest number of votes for President,
shall be the President, if such number be a majority of the whole number of
electors appointed; and if no person have such majority, then from the
persons having the highest numbers not exceeding three on the list of those
voted for as President, the House of Representatives shall choose
immediately, by ballot, the President. But in choosing the President, the
votes shall be taken by states, the representation from each state having
one vote; a quorum for this purpose shall consist of a member or members
from two-thirds of the states, and a majority of all the states shall be
necessary to a choice. And if the House of Representatives shall not choose
a President whenever the right of choice shall devolve upon them, before the
fourth day of March next following, then the Vice-President shall act as
President, as in the case of the death or other constitutional disability of
the President. The person having the greatest number of votes as
Vice-President, shall be the Vice-President, if such number be a majority of
the whole number of electors appointed, and if no person have a majority,
then from the two highest numbers on the list, the Senate shall choose the
Vice-President; a quorum for the purpose shall consist of two-thirds of the
whole number of Senators, and a majority of the whole number shall be
necessary to a choice. But no person constitutionally ineligible to the
office of President shall be eligible to that of Vice-President of the
United States.
From http://www.scruz.net/~jds/jon/US-Constitution.htm#2

Kimberly Herbert (kimberly@wcc.net)
These are my oppinions sent through my personal e-mail

-----Original Message-----
From: L. P. Skeen [mailto:lpskeen@living-tree.net]
Sent: Monday, November 06, 2000 3:33 PM
To: ArtsEdNet Talk
Subject: Re: jumping into the fray

1. Whose bright idea was this anyway? How can we change it so that our
votes actually matter?

2. When did we elect the electoral college? I don't remember voting for
any of them.

3. How do you know which candidate your electoral college is being paid to
vote for?

L

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