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Re: [teacherartexchange] copying (and I'm venting)


From: Jeff Pridie (jeffpridie_at_TeacherArtExchange)
Date: Sun Aug 13 2006 - 12:56:53 PDT


You have brought up very good points. I plan on
sharing your response with a group of other art
teachers to generate a discussion. I appreciate your
candid and straight forward response. Your "venting"
is insightful.

Jeff (minnesota)

--- Patricia Knott <> wrote:

> On Aug 13, 2006, at 11:33 AM, Ann Heineman wrote:
> >
> > This, indeed, is an interesting subject, and
> thank you, and others
> > who posted, for your ideas! As someone who lacks
> stereopsis
> > (ability to see in 3-D) and has eye movement
> difficulties due to
> > nystagmus, I am challenged to do drawings from
> observation,
> > especially if I don't have time to focus and spend
> time with the
> > drawing. You may not be aware of children who
> have visual
> > impairments, including color blindness, in your
> classrooms. So it
> > is important to provide a full scale of
> opportunities to your
> > students to help them to SEE. Another exercise
> might be to
> > blindfold the students, place an object in their
> hands, along with
> > paper and pencil on the desk/table, and ask them
> to draw what they
> > "feel." Descriptions of how a smooth form feels
> as opposed to a
> > rough form, for example, may provide another aid
> for their seeing
> > and rendering, as may the "upside-down" drawing
> technique.
> >
> >
> Ann offers some interesting insights to learning
> styles, problems and
> disabilities and how do we answer all of those?
> I'm not sure any more what "copying" is OR what
> observation is?
> Certainly contemporary art is filed with copy and
> mimicry.
> I think we have to think long and hard if DRAWING is
> the start point
> for art education? and in how many ways can we
> accomplish
> observation? We have all kinds of devices now
> (cellphones,
> digital cameras, i-pods, camcorders, web cams...)
> that can capture a
> moment immediately. How much do our news services
> rely on immediate
> cellphone images? a lot.
> And, I really have to wonder why I ask a kid to
> spend a long time
> capturing in a drawing when it can be immediate with
> devices.
> So what is it that we need to teach about
> observation?
> we need to teach to be keen and insightful and know
> how to weed out
> we need to teach the ability to make decisions about
> all the images
> that barrage our daily lives.
> I spent many years in the Fashion Industry that
> thrives on copying.
> The trick was to take what was successful and turn
> it around and make
> a new success. This is what I always remember and
> this is what I
> want my students to know--- taking from, and
> mimicking is normal BUT
> how do you turn it around? how do you make it your
> own? what's your
> purpose and intent? and how do you invent? From
> what sources do you
> make it an invention? I'm not sure how I knew to be
> inventive other
> than the fear of copying ? So what is that lesson?
> I think it's almost a given today that kids go on
> the internet and
> find stuff and just "think " it's okay to use . I
> think I have no
> idea of what can and what can't be. And I
> really think it is
> big part of our job to teach what is appropriate
> I have really put drawing low on my priorities. I
> don't want to
> spend time reeling with upside down or in inside
> out. But I do want
> to take time with what works and what doesn't work.
> I often find
> some of the most innocent, most unaccomplished
> drawings come from
> the questions of insight. I often find students, put
> off by the
> drawing demands, find their own ways and means to
> accomplish an
> expression. Ask questions to make them think ---
> make them wonder
> where the copy images can go.??? Orchestrate the
> best big questions.
> I always love, wherever it came from, "take a line
> for a walk"
> if you teach them how to walk a line --
> they will---
> and if you teach them to step off the line-- they
> will,
> and if it's through alternate means of expression
> then let that
> expression shine.
> I keep wondering why we hold on to this drawing
> thing? I draw, I love
> to draw, But it's not the norm, or is it so
> necessary.
> Cameras record and hold.
> Can someone tell me why it is important for a
> student to go through
> the pain and agony of having to draw, when they know
> they can't
> (just as I know I can't make music or get beyond 1+2
> =3 and know
> that any tricks will not get me to care about
> making music or going
> beyond simple math)
> Let's let go of the drawing and let's see that each
> kid finds a way
> to express through any means Art allows for all
> means. Everybody
> talks about the standards and meeting them, But
> they are so open you
> can use any method to achieve the goals. Drawing is
> not a standard.
> I truly would like to rewrite the standards and put
> and then have all think about how we observe. ...
> and I bet, if
> polled, drawing isn't near the top. What we need to
> teach is SEEING
> and how to comment on the seen. And if the seeing
> comes from ways
> and means that don't fit our standards then give it
> up and figure out
> what the kids standards are.
> Art about paint and pencils and clay will only
> become collectibles
> for the PBS Road show. Art about where it's going is
> something we
> have to seriously think about.
> I'm feeling that for 30 years art has gone no place
> except offensive.
> And why is that? What are we not delivering? ( Oh ,
> I think the
> DBAE "do the style of stuff.") Why is it that this
> thing I LOVE and
> cherish flounders in mediocrity and has become only
> something
> between great auction prices and survival at local
> fairs? Where do
> we find the place and incentive to spur the
> youngsters on to becoming
> Picasso or who ever where the movers and shakers?
> I'm sorry , I'm very cranky. I don't want to go back
> to school and
> face all these questions I pose. 'Cause it's
> exhausting. I'd much
> rather have a lesson that didn't require thinking or
> wasn't some
> formula. But it's my duty to make them THIINK.
> So
> I think, just how much time I want to spend on
> drawing lessons and
> what for? and if I can get them to get "there" by
> some other means
> why is it less valuable?
> Patty
> ---
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